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Post by dkm on Jul 27, 2016 12:35:01 GMT -8
Officially 50 men have held the title over 90 different reigns
Ric Flair has held it 9 times
Harley Race 7 times
Jeff Jarrett 6 times
Adam Peace 5
Rhodes, Baba, Styles, and Thez have held it 3 time
9 men have held it twice
33 men held it once
Longest Reign Lou Thez at 2300 days
Short Reign Shane Douglas a few minutes
Average reign 267 days (just under 9 months) Median reign 126 days (just over 4 months)
Last person to reign for a year plus was Blue Demon Jr (though Jax Dane is less than 2 months away) Prior to that you have to go back to the 4 year reign of Dan Severn
Last time there were back to back year plus long reigns was Jack Brisco's second reign and Terry Funk
Only 20 reigns by 13 men have been over a year
Only Thez (3), Brisco (2) and Flair (5) have had multiple year plus reigns.
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Post by ZEKE on Jul 27, 2016 16:42:12 GMT -8
Officially 50 men have held the title over 90 different reigns
Ric Flair has held it 9 times
Harley Race 7 times
Jeff Jarrett 6 times
Adam Peace 5
Rhodes, Baba, Styles, and Thez have held it 3 time
9 men have held it twice
33 men held it once
Longest Reign Lou Thez at 2300 days
Short Reign Shane Douglas a few minutes
Average reign 267 days (just under 9 months) Median reign 126 days (just over 4 months)
Last person to reign for a year plus was Blue Demon Jr (though Jax Dane is less than 2 months away) Prior to that you have to go back to the 4 year reign of Dan Severn
Last time there were back to back year plus long reigns was Jack Brisco's second reign and Terry Funk
Only 20 reigns by 13 men have been over a year
Only Thez (3), Brisco (2) and Flair (5) have had multiple year plus reigns.
So is this one of those trick you into debate threads? Flair was a 10 time champion; Race an 8 time champion...
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Post by dkm on Jul 27, 2016 18:25:52 GMT -8
Not currently, the New Zealand title change is not recognized. The title was "returned" to Flair.
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Post by ZEKE on Jul 28, 2016 14:19:28 GMT -8
Not currently, the New Zealand title change is not recognized. The title was "returned" to Flair. Where did you get this info from? it was acknowledged by the NWA board in 1992 along with Tatsumi Fujinami's win, so who rescinded it?
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Post by dkm on Jul 28, 2016 14:49:54 GMT -8
Not sure who did. Just know the current official list.
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Post by ZEKE on Jul 30, 2016 20:31:52 GMT -8
Not sure who did. Just know the current official list. I think there is some confusion, Flair and Race traded the titles back and forth - the belts were not returned to him. The incident in the Caribbean with Jack Venano and Carlos Colon in WWC were instances where the champion lost the title (for various reasons) and they just gave the belt back when Flair left WWC.
I'm interested to see this 'official' list and an explanation to rescind the Boards decision to retroactively NOT recognize the New Zealand switch but still recognize the Fujinami switch when they were both approved for recognition at the same time in 1992. I don't even see a reason to NOT recognize something that has been recognized for 25 years... I mean every title history on the net has it in it, why try to be different...?
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Post by dkm on Jul 31, 2016 12:04:58 GMT -8
The whole New Zealand mess was never reported correctly.
The orginal story was Race won the title in New Zealand and lost the title two days later in Singapore.
It was later discovered Race had "won" the title with some contraversy (double pin I think) the night before people had thought.
When they went to Singapore Flair was given the belt back and he came as champion. It was later explained that Flair had filed a protest and was given the title back.
It was all a local storyline. It was later recognized because as a way to not talk about Flair's WWF title reigns.
Fujinami was always different. New Japan always recognized Fujinami as NWA champion and they controlled the board at that time. WCW ignored the NWA and said Flair was world champion.
Basically, WCW officially recognized the title change later using the argument the NWA and WCW World titles were two different titles. Though at the time both WCW and NJPW only saw it as one title.
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Post by dkm on Jul 31, 2016 12:13:59 GMT -8
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Post by ZEKE on Jul 31, 2016 17:52:56 GMT -8
OK - I guess it has been a long time since I had to look at the World title history and I disagree because its internet historians who are changing what is 'legally' recognized by the organization. Wrestling is a work; to say that they had to call Jim Crockett to overrule the fast count is of course kayfabe; he wasn't even president at the time. "Referee's decision is final". Its whatever is needed at the time for the rules and Of course they did it for the pop; a title change to draw interest. Happened in japan a few times.
reminds me of when Flair was WCW champ and they held up the title; he re-won it and was called 12 time champion on TV. Then they later recanted it on TV and said no, he is only 11 still.
That Race DID win the title but then the title was possible given back to Flair it was never determined that the original Race/Flar finish was 'reversed'; it was merely returned to Flair no differently that Nash and Flair had their exchange for the WCW title only it was the wrestler who returned it not the organization. Again, whatever story line 'rules' work for you at the time is what they use... I'm not sure what to believe, but until the NWA turns around and says we no longer legally recognize this title switch, it happened for me. It may not have been how history said it did for 30 some years, but there was still some sort of change of champions...
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Post by dkm on Jul 31, 2016 19:29:10 GMT -8
I'm not sure what to believe, but until the NWA turns around and says we no longer legally recognize this title switch, it happened for me. Well it's not even a footnote on the NWA's title list, so I really don't know what else you want.
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Post by ZEKE on Aug 2, 2016 18:50:20 GMT -8
I'm not sure what to believe, but until the NWA turns around and says we no longer legally recognize this title switch, it happened for me. Well it's not even a footnote on the NWA's title list, so I really don't know what else you want. An explanation of why they would have rescinded recognition for starters; and lets face facts: they copied and pasted the lineage from wrestling-titles.com... and they just erased all footnotes from the copy and paste. Hisaharu Tanabe removed the reign because of evidence presented that the Singapore rematch that may have been in dispute, not by the NWA after investigation.
And going back to Fujinami's match: That change was not recognized by the NWA at the time. New Japan recognized Fujinami as world champion. WCW recognized Flair still as world champion. No other NWA members recognized Fujinami. That was the storyline that there was dispute of the world title which was settled in the rematch; not that Fujinami was NWA champion and Flair was WCW champion. That was retroactively recognized by the NWA at the 1992 meetings that this was a full title switch. Again as mentioned, this was done to give Flair 10 title reigns when he returned to WCW so that they could count these missing NWA reigns instead of his 2 WWF reigns.
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Post by dkm on Aug 4, 2016 7:34:15 GMT -8
It's not they did a press release or explained anything when they recognized it. In the greater scheme of life, whether this is officially recognized or not is meaningless. So just accept it.
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Post by cwfhmarquez on Aug 4, 2016 11:09:18 GMT -8
Not currently, the New Zealand title change is not recognized. The title was "returned" to Flair. Actually, we (my days on BOD) overruled this and recognized the New Zealand switch at one of our Annual Meetings.
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Post by dkm on Aug 4, 2016 12:14:11 GMT -8
It's been changed since then, currently Flair's second title reign is from winning the title from Race to winning until losing it to Kerry Von Erich. Race winning the title in New Zealand is looked at no differently than the Midnight Rider winning it from Flair and then have the title returned to Flair for not taking off the mask.
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Post by ZEKE on Aug 4, 2016 16:40:31 GMT -8
Not currently, the New Zealand title change is not recognized. The title was "returned" to Flair. Actually, we (my days on BOD) overruled this and recognized the New Zealand switch at one of our Annual Meetings. Exactly, this is my point: it is recognized officially by the NWA at one time; internet title historians have found new information regarding a particular title switch, and THEY feel it shouldn't be recognized. The NWA did not go back and say "We don't recognize this again". That's my point.
Think of it like this: the WWF recognizes a fictitious tournament final between the North American champion and South American champion to create the Intercontinental championship. It never happened. The WWF still recognizes it as happening but we all no it didn't. Its a phantom match that the WWF recognizes as official, and phantom switches have happened forever. Even if Race won the title, and 2 days later its returned to Flair without a match, its a Phantom switch that the NWA voted to recognize in 1992 regardless if it happened or not. That's not up to internet title historians to change. They don't tell the NWA what to recognize legally. If the NWA comes out and says we don't recognize this change anymore, then I have no argument anymore and not just a copy and lift of wrestling-titles.com's title lineage and saying "this is what the NWA recognizes"
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